Islamic Center Near the World Trade Center Site
It has become evident from watching and reading U.S. media that the debate raging over the building of a New York City Islamic center near the WTC site is a hugely contentious issue right now. We’d like to bring the issue to PeaceNext, and ask you for your thoughts and comments on this issue. Should the Islamic center be built? Do Americans have a right to be offended if such a building is built so close to the WTC site? If construction is rejected, would such a rejection be an affront to religious liberty? Please provide your viewpoints, and we simply ask that you keep the conversation civil and respectful of all opinions.
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Rhonda-honda on -
*my opinion*
In the US we pride ourselves on freedom, liberty and justice for all. Does not matter what color your skin, what faith or religion you have, or where you are from. EVERYONE that is a US citizen is *guaranteed* these rights - regardless.
Just because of a small group within a religion may be corrupt or dishonorable to their religion - does NOT mean that ALL of them in that group are.
Many Christians killed thousands during the witch trials in our history, but that does not mean that *all* Christians are bad. We don't hate all Christians because of this.
All throughout history, you can look to any religion and see anger, hostility, war, death, and wrongful acts.
How can we say we are a country of Freedoms, if we don't allow that freedom?
In the United States, freedom of religion is a constitutionally guaranteed right provided in the religion clauses of the First Amendment. Freedom of religion is also closely associated with separation of church and state, a concept advocated by Thomas Jefferson.
In the United States, the religious civil liberties are guaranteed by the First Amendment to the United States Constitution:
“ Congress shall make no law respecting the establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances. ”
The "Establishment Clause," stating that "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion," is generally read to prohibit the Federal government from establishing a national church ("religion") or excessively involving itself in religion, particularly to the benefit of one religion over another. Following the ratification of the Fourteenth Amendment to the United States Constitution and through the doctrine of incorporation, this restriction is held to be applicable to state governments as well.
We need to let PEACE prevail, and not let stigmas, fear, or irrational theories, ruin this. Tolerance and respect should be upheld here. Let them build their Mosque, let them show us that they are peaceful! Through that, it will heal & mend the broken trust between so many. There is too much hatred, and ignorant theories, let them have their guaranteed Freedom & Rights.
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Permalink Reply by Sufi Films on -
What did I tell ya . . . . .
Ground Zero Mosque Imam Is Globalist Stooge
http://www.infowars.com/ground-zero-mosque-imam-is-globalist-stooge/
Imagine my shock!
Muslims GO Home! My position has now changed, Muslims in America deserve America.
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Permalink Reply by Mystic Tourist on -
Sufi Films,
I checked out that site. You are consistent. Do you consider sources less extreme than this to inform yourself? I personally like to keep myself balanced. I like to measure information against diversity. I feel I am more likely to understand when I expose myself to diversity of opinion.
Sufi Films said:What did I tell ya . . . . .
Ground Zero Mosque Imam Is Globalist Stooge
http://www.infowars.com/ground-zero-mosque-imam-is-globalist-stooge/
Imagine my shock!
Muslims GO Home! My position has now changed, Muslims in America deserve America.
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Permalink Reply by Rabbi Roger Ross on -
Willow(Helena) said:*my opinion*
In the US we pride ourselves on freedom, liberty and justice for all. Does not matter what color your skin, what faith or religion you have, or where you are from. EVERYONE that is a US citizen is *guaranteed* these rights - regardless.
Just because of a small group within a religion may be corrupt or dishonorable to their religion - does NOT mean that ALL of them in that group are.
Many Christians killed thousands during the witch trials in our history, but that does not mean that *all* Christians are bad. We don't hate all Christians because of this.
All throughout history, you can look to any religion and see anger, hostility, war, death, and wrongful acts.
How can we say we are a country of Freedoms, if we don't allow that freedom?
In the United States, freedom of religion is a constitutionally guaranteed right provided in the religion clauses of the First Amendment. Freedom of religion is also closely associated with separation of church and state, a concept advocated by Thomas Jefferson.
In the United States, the religious civil liberties are guaranteed by the First Amendment to the United States Constitution:
“ Congress shall make no law respecting the establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances. ”
The "Establishment Clause," stating that "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion," is generally read to prohibit the Federal government from establishing a national church ("religion") or excessively involving itself in religion, particularly to the benefit of one religion over another. Following the ratification of the Fourteenth Amendment to the United States Constitution and through the doctrine of incorporation, this restriction is held to be applicable to state governments as well.
We need to let PEACE prevail, and not let stigmas, fear, or irrational theories, ruin this. Tolerance and respect should be upheld here. Let them build their Mosque, let them show us that they are peaceful! Through that, it will heal & mend the broken trust between so many. There is too much hatred, and ignorant theories, let them have their guaranteed Freedom & Rights.
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Permalink Reply by Mystic Tourist on
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It does seem that this controversy is just ginned up hype. There is no intention to build a mosque at 'ground zero'. The proposed site is two blocks from the perimeter of the World Trade Center Complex. In usual New York City Blocks it is a distance of about six standard city blocks, from the perimeter of the trade center complex.
It is hard to glean the facts from the hype. I think that is because this issue is more hype than anything else. As near as I can tell my statement as to relative proximity and location is accurate. It seems this controversy has little to do with the proposed Islamic Center. It seems the Islamic Center is being used as a ruse to gin up controversy for political agendas. Politics as usual in an election year.
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Permalink Reply by Sufi Films on
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What you fail to understand is that the influx of a SELECT intentionally troublesome group of Muslims into this country is an attempt to Divide and Rule - A Globalist strategy to intiate a Worl government. If Muslims were permitted to enter without being hand selected to cause division, we would not be having this conversation. Our anger should not be focused on the pawns in this diabolical plan, it should be focused fully upon the corrupt government - a government overthrown by Globalists and Ugenisists want 80% of the worlds population exterminated and are doing so by poisoning the ater food and air. America is under attack and the planned disruption of America with an influx of a population of people no one would want to associaate with was all part of the plan. Our country is under full attack - YOU HAD BETTER KNOW YOUR ENENY and your worst enemy is Satin.
A recent Senate bill has outlawed the growing trading and selling of food. WAKE UP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! They are here to control and slowly kill you!!
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Permalink Reply by Sufi Films on
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You deem this extream, but EVERYTHING they offer is backed up with exact evidence, unlike CNN, ABC, NBC and FOX that you likely get your information from. It is the most popular website on the Internet and growing faster than any other source. Call it extream if you like, I call it accurate, balanced and independent reporting.
Mystic Tourist said:Sufi Films,
I checked out that site. You are consistent. Do you consider sources less extreme than this to inform yourself? I personally like to keep myself balanced. I like to measure information against diversity. I feel I am more likely to understand when I expose myself to diversity of opinion.
Sufi Films said:What did I tell ya . . . . .
Ground Zero Mosque Imam Is Globalist Stooge
http://www.infowars.com/ground-zero-mosque-imam-is-globalist-stooge/
Imagine my shock!
Muslims GO Home! My position has now changed, Muslims in America deserve America.
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Permalink Reply by Sufi Films on
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It is designed to destract you away from the wholesale rape of America. America is conquered and the Globalists have won while Americans worry about celebrities, our alledged freedoms and rights.
Mystic Tourist said:It does seem that this controversy is just ginned up hype. There is no intention to build a mosque at 'ground zero'. The proposed site is two blocks from the perimeter of the World Trade Center Complex. In usual New York City Blocks it is a distance of about six standard city blocks, from the perimeter of the trade center complex.
It is hard to glean the facts from the hype. I think that is because this issue is more hype than anything else. As near as I can tell my statement as to relative proximity and location is accurate. It seems this controversy has little to do with the proposed Islamic Center. It seems the Islamic Center is being used as a ruse to gin up controversy for political agendas. Politics as usual in an election year.
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Permalink Reply by Mystic Tourist on
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Sufi,
Am I to understand that you believe the U. S. State department is bringing in people known to be hostile to western values and life so that they can work against us. That they are conspiring to dupe us into believing the whole business is harmless. That this conspiracy is so sophisticated that only InfoWars.com can tell us about it?
Sufi Films said:It is designed to destract you away from the wholesale rape of America. America is conquered and the Globalists have won while Americans worry about celebrities, our alledged freedoms and rights.
Mystic Tourist said:It does seem that this controversy is just ginned up hype. There is no intention to build a mosque at 'ground zero'. The proposed site is two blocks from the perimeter of the World Trade Center Complex. In usual New York City Blocks it is a distance of about six standard city blocks, from the perimeter of the trade center complex.
It is hard to glean the facts from the hype. I think that is because this issue is more hype than anything else. As near as I can tell my statement as to relative proximity and location is accurate. It seems this controversy has little to do with the proposed Islamic Center. It seems the Islamic Center is being used as a ruse to gin up controversy for political agendas. Politics as usual in an election year.
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Permalink Reply by Rhonda-honda on
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I respectfully say ~ I don't believe it. No offense, but "conspiracy theories" have been around forever.. If there were any truth to them, more main-stream public would know about them & you'd *see* things happening {evidence clear & precise}. I don't see the Islamic Center 'people' allowing the gov't to use them like that.. Seems that would be quite offensive.
If they are using it for a political agenda ~ what is it gaining them? Does no good. Too controversial of a topic, and too personal to so many for it to really do any good. One of those "damned if you do & damned if you don't" -- no correct side -- type of topics, dividing more than uniting.
Problem with most conspiracy theories is that they are much to general, labeled "the government" or "the big business" never any precise person(s) mentioned. Due to the fact there would be a lawsuit I'm sure. Perhaps if there were clear and precise evidence, pictures, something other than generalizations, I may be more willing to believe. One of those things where it is up to the reader, or the viewer to draw their own conclusions based on generalized things. What one person views as suspicious, another may view as normal. Just depends on the imagination of the reader(s).
I'm not trying to upset or offend you, just saying how I'm interpreting it :)
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Permalink Reply by Sufi Films on
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You need to wake up, many are already waking up, you are still way behind. Listen to level of intelligent discussion on InfoWars.com, you will not find this anywhere, even on PBS. Here is one example taday, The globalist are working for total control. The Senate is passing laws to keep you from growing your own food.
* Catherine Austin Fitts
* Catherine Austin Fitts
Alex welcomes back to the show Catherine Austin Fitts, president of Solari, Inc., the publisher of The Solari Report, and managing member of Solari Investment Advisory Services. Fitts served as managing director and member of the board of directors of the Wall Street investment bank Dillon, Read & Co. Inc., as Assistant Secretary of Housing and Federal Housing Commissioner at the United States Department of Housing and Urban Development in the first Bush Administration, and was the president of Hamilton Securities Group, Inc. Alex covers attempts by the government to ban the i-dosing phenomenon and the latest news. He also takes your calls.
Mystic Tourist said:You have made it clear that your view is very negative concerning this. As near as I can tell you think there is a conspiracy to introduce an Islamic culture, to america, for the expressed purpose of injuring america. You seem to think there is an impurity designed for this purpose. I suppose we need 'spiritual protection' due to this design. I tend toward cynicism and doubt your grand conspiracy. I am confidant in what does protect us spiritually. We alone can injure ourselves spiritually, no injury can be brought against us spiritually except by our consent. Perhaps there is a conspiracy. I do not know.
Sufi Films said:The Sufi Way, which you may gather from my Sufi Films designation, is a method I subscribe to myself. But I must say that the Sufi way is through Darga's, not modeled after the American Mosque (country clubs). I would love to see Darga's Derga's Dargahs, however you may want to spell it, located across America. They are spiritual centers, more akin to an intentional community. They should be lead by Americans for Americans. America will need these communities in the very near future. They will also need spiritual protection for it is the only real protection available to mankind.
However, a dargah, a traditional Sufi center, is not what is being proposed here. I am sorry to have to say, but when, not if, but when this economy completely crashes, Muslims will be targeted and will find it very difficult to survive in the US. Anyone thinking otherwise might want to research a site called www.infowars.com
Peace, I hope.
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Permalink Reply by Sufi Films on
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You need to do some more reading. Find me a site with a higher level of discussion than InfoWars.com I will be happy to consider all arguments.
Look at the guest line-up on InfoWars today . . . .
* Catherine Austin Fitts
* Catherine Austin Fitts
Alex welcomes back to the show Catherine Austin Fitts, president of Solari, Inc., the publisher of The Solari Report, and managing member of Solari Investment Advisory Services. Fitts served as managing director and member of the board of directors of the Wall Street investment bank Dillon, Read & Co. Inc., as Assistant Secretary of Housing and Federal Housing Commissioner at the United States Department of Housing and Urban Development in the first Bush Administration, and was the president of Hamilton Securities Group, Inc. Alex covers attempts by the government to ban the i-dosing phenomenon and the latest news. He also takes your calls.
Don't take my word for it.
Helena said:I respectfully say ~ I don't believe it. No offense, but "conspiracy theories" have been around forever.. If there were any truth to them, more main-stream public would know about them & you'd *see* things happening {evidence clear & precise}. I don't see the Islamic Center 'people' allowing the gov't to use them like that.. Seems that would be quite offensive.
If they are using it for a political agenda ~ what is it gaining them? Does no good. Too controversial of a topic, and too personal to so many for it to really do any good. One of those "damned if you do & damned if you don't" -- no correct side -- type of topics, dividing more than uniting.
Problem with most conspiracy theories is that they are much to general, labeled "the government" or "the big business" never any precise person(s) mentioned. Due to the fact there would be a lawsuit I'm sure. Perhaps if there were clear and precise evidence, pictures, something other than generalizations, I may be more willing to believe. One of those things where it is up to the reader, or the viewer to draw their own conclusions based on generalized things. What one person views as suspicious, another may view as normal. Just depends on the imagination of the reader(s).
I'm not trying to upset or offend you, just saying how I'm interpreting it :)
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